chuckle have you ever had a person you couldn’t get through to something that you couldn’t manipulate then what what do you do when you can’t get through well yeah of course I’ve had people that I could not get through to it and generally speaking these people are like level 12 arrogance that’s what they are giant ego that’s what causes this there was quite a few seal leaders that I dealt with I shouldn’t say quite a few there were several seal leaders that I dealt with that were like that and of several business leaders that I’ve dealt with that I were like that in podcast number five I read that counseling letter hmm corrective measures to a guy that was really arrogant and despite that letter he did not change and he got fired so what do you do when you got someone that you can’t get through to you you fire them that’s if they’re if and here’s what you got to do is what what makes that tricky is that some people and this may this this will make people freak out there are some people that they’re such good performers that even though they’re slightly negative on maybe their team participation but they’re so good that that it offsets their negativity right and that happens it happens you know what happens with sales people sales people are are in order to be in a sales position you got to be confident you got to be aggressive you got to be somewhat arrogant right you got to believe in yourself and so some salespeople take that to the extreme where they’re just like I don’t need to listen to what you’re telling me the new procedures are yeah screw that I’m the one that’s doing the big dollars over here how about you follow my procedures boys right so so that happens well then what you got to do is you got to look does is this guy producing so well now that can create problems within the team mmm and you have to balance those things it is this guy is the negative is creating offset by the awesome product if ateva tees do it and furthermore if the guy is that good hey maybe we should be modeling some things after them I have no problem with that if you’re the best performer cool I want to imitate you I want to get my people to him at 8:00 you so that happens at the other place where you might see it a similar situation is a leader that does really good with their relationships down the chain of command for instance but it really has bad relations up the chain of command so again you got to ask yourself okay if I fire this leader how many of these people that he has great relationships are now gonna leave and what kind of detriment is that to the team that can also happen with someone that doesn’t that treats their people like crap but up the chain of command everyone thinks is great and and he’s getting the mission done by the way mmm right he’s a slave driver and he’s creating total animosity between him and his team but he’s accomplishing the mission so now how would he do there’s a risk everyone could quit there’s risk you could fire them and now you don’t accomplish the mission anymore this is why leadership is hard and this is why you have to balance everything mm-hmm you have to balance those things but talked about it a bunch of times if you get someone you coach them you mentor them you do everything you can you flank them you do jujitsu mental jujitsu on them you try and get them squared away and eventually if you can’t you weigh against you know how it’s gonna affect the situation and then in many cases you got to let them go and we fired you know we fired five saw plenty of seals get fired from leadership positions and and same thing with you know obviously we work with consulting businesses we see all kinds of people getting fired because they’re either not capable of doing their job they’re too arrogant and they don’t recognize that things are going sideways and they’re just thinking that they’re doing everything perfect no that’s not gonna work out well for you hmm you know what did I think is Lafe someone asked him you know when do you know when’s that line where it’s like when it’s time to fire someone yeah and he was like in a nutshell there’s a lot to it but in a nutshell which that was dope he said it’s you know you’re at that point where you fire someone when when you don’t feel bad about it right right so it’s like yeah you you every tried everything and and there’s also people boots there’s some validity to this that say the first time you think you should fire someone you should fire that’s the other end of the spectrum right and what that means is when you’re looking at someone and you’re going man okay I can save them I can help that’s the kind of advice you give to someone that’s that’s a that’s got a maternal instinct right that you meet someone hey I know this guy’s just a good guy and everyone my team is great and everyone’s gonna do great job you can’t tell that person what life and I normally tell people which is when you feel good about it you should fire him because that person will never feel good about firing anybody just insane because he decided duska I know he’s gonna make it no he’s gonna come around you know I and then they then they start playing the the extreme ownership game which is you know if I would have given EKKO a better direction he would have been able to do this it’s my fault yeah I’ve given EKKO 17 iterations of this and he still didn’t complete it correctly he’s fired that’s the way it works right there’s yeah the balance so that spectrum of of you know being within the confines of being justified firing somebody a certain type of person you gotta say when you don’t feel bad about it right right I mean that’s like a fire heavy type dude right but there’s also someone the reason you shouldn’t feel bad about it is because I’ve done everything I can do to help you yeah which takes work it takes effort it takes tact it takes hard conversations because it’s hard for me to go and say echo you know I’ve been I’ve been looking at your videos lately and they’re they’re not really what we’re looking for right I don’t want to say that to you and you know it’s uncomfortable and we’re kind of like you know we we want to get along so instead I’m like yeah echo that that video is good man yeah it’s good but I’m not telling you the truth and then over time our videos are looking good enough and eventually I say you know what you know we’re no one’s buying our videos anymore or and we haven’t gotten in new contracts so guess what I’m gonna have to let you go you’re like what about you said all the videos I made were good now you’re firing me maybe you need to become a better salesperson yeah whereas if I had the hard conversation early and said hey echo you know I know you’re creative and I appreciate that but we also need to get the message across for our clients I’m obviously fabricating a business where we’re making videos of applying for clients yeah which I know we don’t really do a lot of anymore occasionally you do but yeah you got oh you got to have the hard conversations earlier if I’m the type of person that doesn’t like to have the hard conversations once again I never feel good about it cuz I never I never gave you any advice so it always feels bad for me to fire someone yeah but if you’re following good leadership tactics then absolutely true when you get to a point where you gotta fire somebody you won’t feel bad about it because you know you’ve done everything you can you know you’ve coach them mentor them and you know that if you keep them on board you are negatively impacting your team which is bad yeah and then go down to the other side of the spectrum still within the confines of being justified in firing somebody by the way but on the other side of the spectrum you get how you say that what do you call the maternal instinct I’m a direct the person who can like they’re they’re just super hard on themselves maybe or they’re you know like even if you did do everything you can you still like I coulda done more you know so it’s my fault that is I feel like I let them down as a leader yeah give them 17 counseling chits yeah you know they don’t belong here you can’t do their job stop yeah I mean well they’re going home laughing at you or whatever yeah yeah you get that kind of personality so it’s kind of like how you say you gotta balance it you got to be like okay you gotta recognize okay what kind of person am i you know or what kind of person is this other person kind of thing and if they’re those maternal instinct jool for lack of a better with one person then what was it the first time you feel like you should fire them you should fire you you hang out on that side of the spectrum you gotta yeah
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