Video URL: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHtZZ-kSGU8
I feel like I'm struggling to breathe. It blew my [ __ ] mind. I don't know whose dick I've got to suck to get [ __ ] respect around here. True. Jordi went through incredible adversity to get to where he is today. Depression, anxiety, and he's one of the few people that's willing to tell you about it. Me ego was just going [ __ ] crazy. I'm the man. All the worst parts of me amplified. It was It was better than a drug. It was better than anything. It was like, wow. I would have carried on doing that probably if I hadn't have had a moment of like boom. It just felt like everything I'd been building to had been like really like [ __ ] up. I know I needed humbled, but it was brutal. I literally wanted to kill myself. Like, you know, I really really did. When you love someone more than anything else in this world, that matters more than anything. And where others would have capitalized on a so story, she was far too precious for me to share. She was mine. She wasn't there for anyone else. She was just my mom. And I miss her every [ __ ] day, bro. But once you give it, there's no taking it back. The day I don't need money anymore, that's going to be a scary day for the rest of the internet. I don't I don't want to let the fans down and and I don't want to stop doing what they they love me for, but True Jordy Brian. He's one of the real pioneers in the YouTube space. He runs one of the biggest football shows, the biggest podcast, the biggest boxing shows, and much, much more. But he is at heart not the guy you see on screen. He is a gentle giant. One born in a council estate who went through incredible adversity to get to where he is today. billions of views. His conversations seem to sway cultural conversation, but he's still not getting what he deserves in his opinion and in mine. When you see True Jordy, what you see is this big 6'5 guy with tattoos and huge muscles. But when you peel the layers back, you find the total opposite. You find a small kid in there, one that's still living in the council estate in his mind, and one that's missing his mother after her tragic death a few years ago. He's been to rock bottom. Depression, anxiety, suicidal ideiation, and he's one of the few people that's willing to tell you
about it and tell you about it with full honesty and vulnerability. I've known Brian a long time, and I've been so fascinated by him because he appears to be this contradiction. He appears to be someone that does not give AF, but at the same time, he's incredibly, incredibly sensitive. To me, he's the ultimate reminder that we are all a contradiction and that you should never judge a book by its cover. What you're going to hear today is some stories that Brian has never told. Stories that will move you, some that might move you to tears, but also stories that will inspire you, and teach you some important life lessons about what it really is to be a human being, scars and all. Without further ado, I'm Steven Bartlett and this is the Diver CEO. I hope nobody's listening, but if you are, then please keep this to yourself. How would you define and describe the rise of True Jordy? And when I say that, I'm talking about, take me back, the early days. Okay. The stuff that made you who you are today. Um, I'm an opportunistic person. I like I when I see a tiny little like thing, I just blow it open straight away. So like uh the first um thing that happened to me was I made a random rant about a footballer that went viral. Didn't really do YouTube at all. Just boom. And then loads of people seeing it in the Northeast. It was like this crazy son of a [ __ ] cuz no one really did stuff like that then. I was one of the first guys to do a football run. I want to go back further. What? Really? Yeah. What? Further in how I want to know the the the the insecure kid on the council estate. All right. Okay. um kind of sensitive inside but had to act sort of tough because if you didn't you would be [ __ ] up like you know on the estate like like my shed once got burned down like set on fire just by some kids just cuz it was a shed and it was there you know like you had to carry yourself in a certain way cuz all of our dads were in prison. all of our dads. Like it was like weird, you know what I mean? So, we were sort of raising each
other and like I was like a milk kid at school just cuz I could like drink extra milk and that at like dinner time and stuff. And uh I was smart obviously I'm I'm smart guy but like I was looked upon as like a nightmare. Like my when I was 10 years old my teacher told my mother at parents evening she went you can just tell when some of them are destined for prison can't you? But like she worded it like that, you know what I mean? And my mom's like, "I know exactly what you're saying." But like it was cuz I hated her. She didn't understand me. Get me. She talked down to me. So being talked down to that really pisses me off even at a 10-year-old age. Like I didn't like that. You can win me over and I'll be I'll be brilliant for you. But just respect this. Ask me. Don't tell me. You know, like even and I know that's like a naive way to look at the world, but I was 10 and I just had a chip on my shoulder. And um yeah, didn't like authority. Um and but I always was quite like a little bit competitive. Uh I remember like there was a couple of kids like just little random memories I have of like I was fighting all the time, but like I remember I always thought of myself as one of the smarter lads and there was this thing about like some sort of school day where they selected like the brightest boys and the brightest girls and I wasn't selected. My mom thinking I'm smarter than them, you know, like but I couldn't prove it or whatever or I don't know. I was I was in detention a lot. I got thrown out of school multiple times. Once for pissing on the uh the school teachers lounge window and telling them all to [ __ ] off when I was 8 years old. One for fighting. Uh just just white like rebellious, you know, but like but with a brain and I just needed to like find something to What caused you to be that rebellious 8-year-old kid? I think it's genetic a little bit. My dad was a rebellious man very much so. My mom not at all. My mom loving, caring, kind mother Theresa. My dad uh like a punk rocker who wanted to he like he did m [ __ ] when he was at school. like he took the whole school on strike once just cuz he didn't like a teacher and like he he was known for like he was thrown out of schools for like beating teachers up and stuff like that cuz when
he was like 14 violence was his life. You know what I mean? Do you actually think it's genetic? I think that um yeah I think I think part of what makes me aggressive is my genetic. Yeah. Cuz even the look I get on my face when I'm about to fight is identical to the look my dad gets. Like it's that that switch. Do you know what I mean? So, I'm lucky that I've got it diluted with the kindness of my mother and I finally managed to channel the aggression into later on in life into like focus, into drive, into the good stuff, you know what I mean? But at the time, I didn't I was overwhelmed with whatever the [ __ ] was going on in my head. I didn't really know what the hell it was. I had Joe Wix sat here, you know, the body coach guy, and he um he told me about his mom and his dad, and his mom was very, very caring and compassionate, and his dad would punch um holes in the door. Yeah. Every day, and you know, was violent and abusive. And Joe Wixs has come out as really really compassionate and kind. I don't know if you know him personally, but even, you know, during the during the lockdown, people saw him doing pee with Joe and dancing and doing pee in his in his room and stuff. Was that the the guy who went popular for the PE stuff? Yeah. But he was he was crying and he was he was up deeply upset that there was a lockdown because it would hurt other people. One of the most compassionate people I've ever had met. And his dad was from his account very very um aggressive. So I've always wondered about these generational cycles whether it's you know I think it's different for different people. I personally I believe that there's a cocktail in me that's a real weird mixture of a self-obsessed arrogant showman who was my dad bodybuilder hard man went to prison fighter and then a woman who worked like looking after people very caring compassionate loving charitable generous you know all the good things and I'm not saying my dad can't be good in any way but it was just they were very polar opposite people and for me I I see that come out in me and there's and there's there I believe in both genetic and uh like the sociology side of it as well.
You have any brothers or sisters? I've got a half sister from my dad's side. Yeah. Do you think it makes a difference being an only child of sorts? Uh yeah. Yeah, definitely. Me and Lawrence have had a few conversations. He was an only child, too. Um, and I think it does make you just live in your own head a little bit, you know, and it makes you like I have times where if I spend too much time around people, I'm like, I need a [ __ ] break from this. Like, I want to be on me and just listen to music for a bit. I heard you say this thing. Um, I heard you say that people who live in their own heads and think the most struggle the most. They're they're the ones who are most susceptible to depression, I would say. Yeah. Do you want to come in and watch this podcast live from behind the scenes? If you do, all you have to do is hit the subscribe button. And now that the world has opened up, you'll be behind the scenes as many of our subscribers have been. I can't wait to meet you. So, take me through the ride. So, we I know every it's well documented how you became to be a YouTuber. Yeah. Apologies. I'm just used to rehearsing. Yeah, I know. Yeah. And I I don't You're the same. You tell the story a lot that rolls up. It loses its emotion because I've said it that many times, but Yeah. So, you you you rose as a YouTuber. I want to get to the point where we, you know, money starts coming in. Cuz for me, 23, 24 years old, when money started coming in, I was going to every nightclub on the weekend and getting five bottles of Don Perry on and I was trying to fill some kind of gap in me. Mhm. And from what I saw in your videos, you did a similar pulling similar. I I'd had a bit of money before YouTube cuz I was working offshore on the oil rigs doing me deep sea diving. So that was good money. I was earning about £10,000 a month doing that. And that was a bit of a wild lifestyle cuz I was young. I was working class. I was surrounded by men who were military men
who wanted to go out, beat men up and [ __ ] women and take drugs and and and get drunk, you know? So I was surrounded. They were my male role models, you know. So it was a crazy lifestyle that. So that was kind of partly me getting raised by these [ __ ] men around me. And then obviously um when I found YouTube, it was like a rebirth of like oh um like I I went in, it's a long story, but I went into a bit of depression coming out of diving and not knowing what the [ __ ] I wanted to do with my life cuz I didn't know like I I knew I didn't want to be a diver anymore. I knew I was done with that. And when I found YouTube, it felt like a little uh window of hope. And then obviously that took off and once I uh once I started getting money, yeah, it was like, okay, I I I made it cuz I I basically gave up on money. I chose YouTube as a path to happiness. That was the idea was give up the money, forget that you're not happy doing that job. I'd rather make minimum wage doing videos than make six figures doing diving. So, I went on that path and then I it dawned on me, oh, I'm going to make more money doing this. Actually, once once I was in the thousands a month, it was a bit of a oh [ __ ] like, okay, how do I handle this? And I thought I had a good handle on it. Like, it was little stuff at first, new car, move, move house, better place, and all that. And then once I came to London, that was when it really went tits up to be honest with you. I just started spending money like crazy. I bought three new cars in the space of about 18 months. Um, not altogether, like one after the other sort of thing, but like um I was able to get things that I never dreamt possible. And that was the moment of like, oh, I can have this like my favorite car ever. Wow. Uh, bought an Audi R8 first. That went fast. Nice blue Audi R8. Beautiful. Then I swapped that for a McLaren uh which they had the convertible. the roof come down. I thought I was the dog's bollocks and that especially a guy like me like what the [ __ ] am I doing in a McLaren, you know? It look ridiculous cuz I'm so huge. And then I swapped that for a Bentley um GT 6 L um the Continental. Um white leather interior. Gorgeous. All black wheels black everything. Oh,
black and white. There's this bit you talked about when you leave diving and you kind of lose your orientation and that gives you minor depression which is seems to be so common in people when they they lose their purpose and I mean I had Tom Bloomfield sat here as well it was very similar they lose their sense of purpose in life their direction they feel that disorientation they feel the depression then you went after something that you thought would give you like intrinsic internal joy and then it becomes a a career and I read this study which I found fascinating that in Um, in in psychology, if they give someone a game that they enjoy and they play it, they enjoy it. D, and then if they then give them the same game and pay them to do it, they lose joy. So, when you start paying someone to do something that they once did for the sheer fun of it, they lose the fulfillment they're getting from it. I've seen it in boxing and stuff like that a lot. Like the passion goes once it becomes monetary and obl obligatory like you have to do it. It's not I'm getting up and doing this passion now and but I' I've never lost a passion for video making that's still there. I love it. Um but um yeah, I lost my way like this whole thing of doing something for the right reasons because I'd never experienced that kind of money before. I I remember like driving that Audi, the first one, the Audi R8 when I drove that off the parking lot. That was a moment of like, what the [ __ ] Like, it just blew me mind. You know what I mean? The fact that I was able to to drive a car worth um it was worth $100,000 and I paid for it in cash. You didn't? Really? Boom. Yeah. I was like and uh and I remember just driving it and it was it honestly I I don't regret it because even though it was a complete waste of [ __ ] money and I wasted even more money swapping it for the other two cars, it was a real healthy lesson to learn and get out my system. But it was like a drug, you know? It was it was better than a drug. It was better than anything. It was like, wow, this is like for me. I don't know what it is about fast cars and they look nice and the way you feel when you're in just makes you
feel like a [ __ ] movie star or something, you know? Um especially coming from a place where people set fire to your shed because there was a shed, you know, like nobody had a nice car where I came from, you know, it wasn't people didn't even have like a Mercedes or a BMW, let alone a super car. So that was mindblowing, you know what I mean? And they just it was too much for us. Just was. And I me ego was just going [ __ ] crazy. You know what I mean? Like I'm the man, you know? All the worst parts of me just amplified. There's there must be a reason why you got you traded it in so many times though, right? I was addicted to that feeling. The new the new [ __ ] that that was the oh but but what if Oh. And then I see in the McLaren. I remember driving it into the [ __ ] the super car place. I look at the McLaren. I look back at me out here. I was like, I don't really And then I just kept looking at Mac going, it's new. That's the new [ __ ] The new hotness. And you know, it's ridiculous. Just absolutely idiotic. Never ends. Yeah. I would have carried on. I would have carried on doing that probably if I hadn't have had a moment of like that boom. You know what I mean? What are you doing, mate? You know, health health. Life's good at that. Give you a good slap around the head when you need it. And I really needed it. You know what I mean? Because everything that a man does when he's from nothing, like all these rappers, you know, I was doing the same thing like spunk money up the wall, buy pointless jewelry, clothes, [ __ ] like that, treating people the wrong way, treating myself the wrong way, not looking after myself. I piled away on I think I just skipped like the good years to Elvis at the end. Do you know what I mean? Like I just went full throttle. Um, so yeah, you said boom. Oh yeah. Yeah. So I had a bit of a moment where everything was just you know came crashing down. There was um a lot of people know there was the DMs but also in the same week there was the um the loss of a huge deal. Um, which for anybody that doesn't know the DMs,
some somebody leaked some DMs that some I had sexual DMs that were out there. Um, and um, me being the crazy wild bastard that I was at that moment, you know, drinking a lot, just doing all sort just [ __ ] lost my way. And then in the same week, I also had a a deal that was on the table that was pretty much negotiated, done, signed seal delivered, which would have secured my financial future for the next two years with a huge company, big betting company, multi-million pound deal. It wasn't it wasn't just one, you know what I mean? It was the deal. Um, and they had hired a new guy who thought he knew better than the last guy. Um, and he I think he just like didn't like me. He also I think it was partly like you don't want to carry on the the work of the guy who used to have your job. So he he was trying to find any reason he could to um, you know, [ __ ] it up. And, you know, he did what he did. We got to a point where I was like, are you going to do the deal or not, mate? like and there was um I can't go into specifics cuz I agreed to like keep it you know respectful like but there was some things asked of me which were just outrageous and um we we we couldn't move on basically and I'm I'm very glad I didn't because otherwise everything I now have might it might not have ended up that way. Do you know what I mean? When when you're put in a position where do you want to do you want to keep your ownership of things or or not? you know what I mean? So, uh, but yeah, that was a devastating blow. And then obviously having people laughing at you for sexual DMs and stuff when, you know, it was I was drunk as [ __ ] at the time and it was just a stupid moment. But regardless, you know, knowing that there's just such little compassion out there for you when you're having a awful time, it really it it it took me I got from as high as I was, it took as low as possible in that moment of like no one cares. everything you've worked hard for, you now don't have. I I'd literally agreed a tenency agreement on my flat for two years on the basis that this was all going to be signed. So, I'm like, how the what what the [ __ ] do I do now? You know what I mean? So, and then I was hit with a tax bill that was way
more than I could handle as well because in my head it's like got the cash coming and got the tax bill paid off, man. Don't worry about it. So everything that could go wrong went wrong. And um you know I know I needed humbled but it was brutal. That was and and I know it might sound to some people like out there like oh uh oh poor pitiful you know white boy problems and [ __ ] like that. But it I literally wanted to kill myself like you know I really really did cuz it it was just too much even for me like and I'm a pretty tough person. It was just it was awful. Like the level of abuse and ridicule I got online and and the financial mess I was in. It just felt like everything I'd been building to had been like really like [ __ ] up. And uh yeah, it was even just talking about it now is hard to to say. Do you know what I mean? Cuz it was bad. It was awful. Um, so that left me in a really really low place. The people online would have had no idea because I I remember watching that play out from afar and it was just online it was just kind of jokes and Well, what you have to remember is they didn't know I'd lost a multi-million pound deal that week. They didn't know I had a six figure tax bill to pay. Yes. So that's happening behind the scenes. And that happened before. Yeah. The before the DM. So then the DMs happened as well. The icing on the cake was the DMs, right? If it was just one or the other, you could say maybe. But when you're financially [ __ ] and you're also trending on Twitter being called, I'm not even going to say the words, but you know, the things people say about gay people that are to hurt them, the things people, you know, you should go and do this, you should you know, and people love to kick people on the way down. what they especially love and this is the difference is if you're a vulnerable person publicly you're seen to be I don't know let let's say you're you're seen to be in some sort of subculture that people view in a way that's like oh poor them I hope they're all right I'm a big strong alpha male I look tough I
look like I can handle all the ridicule in the world I'm brash cocky like you know so they people probably didn't think you like and also when you're a man you don't get sympathy the way women get sympathy when they go through revenge porn or anything like that it's not looked upon the same and I just had to sort of think about and take and go yeah this isn't fair but life isn't fair so what the [ __ ] do you expect Brian like you know um so I drank a lot of whiskey and uh smoked a lot of weed that week if I'm honest with you you know what's so funny is I remember I remember seeing it trending and I I go on his Brian's account and see what he said about it Nothing. Silence. Yeah. Yeah. And that for me was really surprising. Oh yeah. Yeah. I think a lot of people thought that actually. But I even in the chaos I act quite cerebrally. I'm a I'm a I'm I can be quite reptilian when I need to be to get myself out of a You see in diving for example, in the moment of panic, in that moment of like I could [ __ ] die here. I've been in those situations if I don't act smart. I could I'm in a a [ __ ] situation here. I got to use I've got to pull my knife out, cut this rope, do this, do I'm used to thinking like in that way in a So I just thought I'm going to I'm just going to say nothing. I'm going have a have a have a night to think about this. Just just think about how I was I felt awful. Don't get us wrong, but I knew I wasn't going to give up. But even though I wanted to kill myself, I also thought that weirdly I think all the the [ __ ] sort of it gave me something to resist. Do you know what I you know, give me cuz I'm a fighter in my heart. So, I was like, "Nah, [ __ ] you." Um, so, um, within a day I was like, "Okay, this is how we're going to do this. I'm going to get the two best piss takers I know, and I'm going to get them to rip the piss out of me, make everyone feel like it's over and done with now." Because the minute you acknowledge it, laugh it off, and show that you're not frightened, people will get bored, move on to something else, and they'll scratch the itch of saying, cuz what they really want me to do is self-destruct. But if I show I'm brave, they'll respect that and then move on.
But they don't realize is I was pretty [ __ ] drunk during that whole episode. Really? Like I was It was We were recording 11:00 a.m. I was on the whiskey. Like I had like [ __ ] two massive glasses full of whiskey straight. And then I was like, "Right, let's do this." And like cuz I knew they were going to be brutal, but I said, "You have to be you have to just say every worst thing cuz then people will leave me the [ __ ] alone and then I'll really get on with my depression then." Do you know what I mean? So that's how I was like kind of like sensible in planning out my own self-destruction. Smart. Yeah. Yeah. It's very weird. And I've spoken to other people about this when they've been in similar situations like when Logan went through his thing and he was like, "Yeah, same. I just uh drank a lot and smoked a lot." That was that was that was what we both did like you know. So yeah. So that after that happened, I then had to um okay, where do we go from here then? Um and I had a production company who were partnered with us at the time who agreed that they would carry the cost to the kickoff while we were looking for another sponsor. So that was very kind of them. Shout out to Pete. He knows who he is. And um we don't get me wrong, those costs had to be paid back at some point. So every show is x amount of money. Every single fee, you know, and this is the thing that people forget. I've probably got the biggest crew on YouTube really. So there's like 15 people every show who need paid and every every single time we do a kickoff show. That cost was building. My my tax wasn't going anywhere. I needed a [ __ ] sponsor big time. Um so that was it was a bad time. You know what I mean? A lot of pressure. I think that was the thing. Pressure. I felt it from every angle, you know. How how does how does that impact other areas of your life? I I've heard you talk about the impact it had on your sleep, which I think is something people don't think about enough cuz I I think sleep is probably the foundation of your mood, how you make decisions, and everything in between. So,
uh probably um I I still haven't quite mastered that. I think that's the thing that I think partly it's cuz when you have your own business, there's not enough hours in the day. So you're always like late at night being like what else can we do? What else can we do? So I'm [ __ ] at sleeping and like as soon as I wake up by the time I've made it to the toilet for a piss I'm thinking about what we need to do like I it so that's part of it. Um but yeah I I drank myself to sleep to a point where I was more collapsing rather than sleeping you know and uh it was awful. Like I'm going to play just cuz these are the questions that come to mind. You're drinking yourself to sleep, but you're a smart guy. You know that that's not good. Oh, yeah. Yeah. But but at that point, I cared more about uh it was like a almost like it was like a a mathematical equation. It's like what what is more important right now? Me being like I didn't care about myself. I just thought get through the days cuz so my mom died, right? This is totally side thing um previously to that. And I remembered when I got through that, I did a similar thing where I would just I drank myself to sleep for about a month at least. And I knew if I could just get a few weeks under my belt, no matter how I got through it, it would be easier. So I just had to get to that point. And I think I'm not re recommending this, by the way, but few people will go through the kind of week I went through. So luckily, it won't be necessary. But sometimes you've just got to put distance between you and the event and daylight will slowly become uh seeable. I'm not saying it was a good idea. Yeah. Yeah. This is this is Yeah, it does. It sounds like kind of they look good on the movie. Yeah, I can imagine. Yeah, it for me cuz if those issues aren't ever properly addressed, then they kind of reemerge or they they were they So, I hear you. But there's a time and a place and right in the aftermath isn't always the best time to go and go right let's let's figure out what went wrong here. It was emotionally so distressing. I just
thought I am going to [ __ ] every every waking moment was they're all like the the whole thing the finances the twe the all this [ __ ] I couldn't I couldn't address it at that point. I couldn't think about it at that point. I couldn't work out what had gone wrong or all of that. I just thought, get a [ __ ] sponsor. Keep doing the shows. Drink yourself to sleep if you have to. Just get a [ __ ] sponsor. Keep the money coming in because right now without money, you're you're [ __ ] So [ __ ] Like I'm homeless. You know what I mean? Like the amount of bills that were crewing up and the amount of money I had, I was going to end up like I was like I might end up [ __ ] wherever. You know what I mean? Like so it really wasn't about oh let's go and work through my problems. It was like let's put some [ __ ] money in the uh bank. Yeah. Was there one day through that period which you remember as being the most agonizing one particular day? Every single day. Every single day was just as bad as it was like when my mom died that was what it reminded me of. It was like I had died almost like every day I'd wake up. So when my mom died, I remember wake when I'd wake up, I'd go. And it was that first moment when your eyes wake up and you go, "Oh, it's real. It's it's actually happened." And that's the moment where when when my life had ended, it was that moment of when I'd first wake up, I go, "Oh, it's it's real. It's real." And then I'd have to get up and face the day. You know what I mean? And just try and block it out. When I'd go outside, I wore a cap. I'd try everything I could to to hide who I was because I felt ashamed that I was the DM guy or I I used to think of myself as like a great podcaster, someone who had changed his life, brought himself out from and now I was like being like shamed, laughed at, all of that [ __ ] So, I just felt so like humiliated, you know what I mean? I just didn't feel like me anymore. When you said you woke up and you the first couple of seconds you thought it's real. Yeah. Does that mean that your sleep was a place of peace or a place of escapism? Uh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm asking this question because Tom
Bloomfield from Monzo was sat there and he talks about being anxious and depressed for about 2 years and he said when I'd wake and he literally said he's he was here last week. He said when I woke up for two or three seconds I didn't know who I was or where I was and those were the best. And then he said it would just come crashing back down. No. So, the best time was when I was drunk before I went to sleep. That was the point where I really enjoyed it cuz I was like, "Oh, it's like I'm not even here." You know what I mean? So, that was the best time cuz then nothing felt I couldn't feel anything. You know what I mean? That was ideal. That's why I kept going back there every night. But I wasn't an alcoholic or anything. It was that feeling that I was chasing. The I don't feel pain, numbness. Yeah. That was the good bit. you when your mother passed away, you didn't talk about it. No. No. I mean, YouTube's a shitty place, isn't it? It's a horror. Like, as I found out the hard way, you know. So, um, and also, she's just precious to me. So, I uh I keep it to myself always. Um, I keep hurt to myself always. I've only talked about her once online, and that was the rebuild. Yeah. And even in even in that video, which I watched twice, um I still had no idea when it h when it had happened. Yeah. Yeah. Because I was trying to pinpoint if there was like a change in you or if it was during your YouTube career, at the height of your YouTube career before and and I thought it was, you know, for a guy that does really pour it out on the internet. And I've seen you, you know, when the Logan Paul incident happened, I watched that video and you were pouring out your heart in a way that was just remarkably vulnerable. And that was just a secret. Yeah. But it's it's like um it's like what I said earlier. I can be quite cerebral when I have to be and I can make decisions when I have to be. Pardon me. For me own me own sake. And here's the thing. When you love someone more than anything else in this world, that matters more than anything. And where others would have capitalized on a
sub story, she was far too precious for me to share with anyone. You know, it wasn't about she was mine. She wasn't there for anyone else. She was just my mom. Do you know what I mean? And that's the way I I plan to keep it. Do you know what I mean? Um I've I've explained what she meant to us in that video and how much I love her. I always will and I miss her every [ __ ] day, bro. But um it's just one of those things where I think to myself certain things I think you draw the line online, you know, you have to there has to be some stuff that's for you. And even if I say, "Yeah, my mom died and I loved her and she meant the world to us." And I and I did try and give some ins and outs of what my relationship was like with her so that people could feel how much feel the love, you know what I mean? Um, I didn't want to give everything because I don't know, it's just too special for me to to to give everything. Do you know what I mean? Like that. And I think that's one thing that some creators could do with learning as well is like what is how much value does something has if you'll just share it with everyone? And I do think you got to pick and choose, you know what I mean? carefully because once you give it, there's no taking it back. And that's the problem, isn't it? You know what I mean? With YouTube, it's like once it's out there, it's out there. So, in that video, you say when you're you I think you've just been fighting with um is it Vlad's dad? Oh, with Vidal's dad. Vidal's dad. And you I mean you it looks like you've gone like 12 rounds with him or something and you fall over and you're back and you get emotional cuz and he says, you know, that's what boxing does. It brings all those emotions back. And you said a line. You said, "I'm just a a guy that misses his mom." Mhm. Have you ever processed that? Um, yeah. A lot. A lot. Uh, I've truly faced I know everything like about me that's good, bad. I really face up to my to everything in my life. You know what I mean? I know where I've gone wrong. I know I I really face things head on. and and with my mom, I I faced it more than
anything because it was it was a constant in my it it's like losing a parent if you're especially if it's an it's an if you're an only child and there's only one parent, it's um so severe because it's like I try to describe it to someone. It was like one day I went outside and um the whole world was full of water and people are swimming around in their scuba gear or whatever going, "But what what everything's normal, Brian." I'm like, "No, no, you don't understand." Like, like the constants in my life have been like the sun comes up in the morning, I breathe air, you know, the moon comes out at night, my mom loves me. Those four things like or this is reality. So to remove one of those components, it blew my [ __ ] mind like that she couldn't be here anymore. I was like, that doesn't make sense to me. You know what I mean? So, I had to face it and I and I really have processed it as is and and I think that's why I never felt the need to share it either because I was like, you know, I'm at peace with with that as hard as it is. It's just part of my life now. And uh and I and I feel like as uh people say things like this, but I I feel like she's there. I don't I don't need anything from anyone to make me feel better because when when a mother loves her son the way my mother love me, there's nothing anyone can tell me in this world about her, about about me, about us. So, I don't need to share it. You know what I mean? You said you had one parent then. Well, me dad was, you know, around sort of, but like in and out there, you know, he's like he's a he was an old school guy. me dad, you know, like like [ __ ] shagged around, went to prison, just a wild man. Um, but I'm I'm I'm okay with my dad now. I'm I've just reached a place of like understanding that my dad's got bipolar disorder. He's uh he's never going to be quote unquote normal. Like he's just that guy. And uh you know he recently had a a suicide attempt which I had to phone the ambulance for and that and it's like what the [ __ ] hell is this? Like you know what I mean? You're panicking um hoping he's going to be all right. He then got sectioned again um which this was this year you know and uh you had to phone the ambulance.
Yeah. Yeah. Um he text me basically a sort of a message that let me know what was going down you know. So instantly got in the ambulance and then you're panicking cuz the ambulance they're like, "Oh, co co." I'm like, "Well, you [ __ ] just get there." Like, "Are you [ __ ] me?" 2 hours it took them to get there. Two [ __ ] hours. And like it was like a full-blown suicide attempt. Like the pills were already gone. You know what I mean? So, um, yeah, just like the it it's stressful, you know? um when when you go through that and it was I did a podcast about it because you know you don't really know what to do like when my last time my dad was sectioned I was a [ __ ] child like so I'm now his next of kin I'm his his parent now in this situation so he's mentally unstable coming to me asking me for the answers I'm trying to run a company and and do my YouTube videos hey everyone welcome back you know what I mean it's [ __ ] mental and that's one of weird things about uh being a YouTuber is like I know that people rely on me for their escape, but it's sometimes that's why like you you messaged me to do a podcast around that time and I said, "Mate, I ain't doing a [ __ ] podcast right now. I'm not in it." And I didn't cuz I just said I'll just be [ __ ] miserable. I mean, great start anyway. We're talking about sad stuff. But yeah, I I I just knew I couldn't I couldn't do it. You know what I mean? But um yeah, it's been uh me and my dad are all right. like he sometimes he just um he sees things from a different angle because he's got bipolar. So it's it's challenging, you know what I mean, to get him to see where I'm coming from. Sometimes it's so difficult when a when eventually I think a kid has to kind of forgive their parents and start parenting their parents. It's even kind of happened to me in a strange way because I think my mom I think my mom has bipolar. Dude, your mom's such a character. I heard stories and I'm like, yeah, I remember being young and and being told that. Well, I mean, the first one I wrote in my book is when she came to the school in her lingerie
when I was like four or 5 years old because she wanted to put on a show. And then the other instance that sticks in my mind, there's one where she chased my dad through the house with a knife. And the third one I remember is being told that she had been locked up because um they had come to repossess her her restaurant and she was stood in the street with a a knife and she was smashing up her own shop and there was police in the street and everything and I I didn't see that. But we'll have to set them up for a day. No, but there is you get to a point where you realize that I'm not going to have the perfect family that I see in the films and I'm going to have to forgive these people who are meant to be my idols and guardians for their own flaws, you know, and I just Yeah, it's I'm I've made I've I've sort of I've made peace with my dad's mistakes in life. Uh it it's difficult though, you know, you you it's a really long process of why don't you love me? Why won't you be like this? Why aren't you doing that? Why, you know, and as the years go by, you realize other people's parents are also [ __ ] up. You know, how many people can actually say they've got two parents who love each other in a great marriage and have been great parents. Most people I know don't have that situation. Even if their parents are together, it's a [ __ ] [ __ ] show. So, yeah, people are aren't perfect. And um I think just accepting that is a good start to life. Okay, quick one. One of my best friends in the world, Francesca, sent me a text message this week, and I'm going to read it out to you. She said, "Happy Sunday. So, we're thinking of joining the Hule hype. I'm forgetting to eat all of the time, and I end up eating rubbish, so I need to sort it out. Any recommendations to start off with?" And my response to her was, um, any of the ready to drink Hules would be my suggestion. Whatever flavor you think is your preference. Honestly, Francesca, this is a very, very good health decision. And she then replied and said, "Amazing. Excited to get started on it." Um, and I think that demonstrates um the genuine, authentic relationship I have with Hule. I genuinely depend on Hule um because I'm
prone to missing meals. And when I do have my meals, sometimes they're not nutritionally complete to say the least. I'm definitely not getting my vitamins if I don't have Hule because a lot of the food we have today is processed and it's it's filled with a lot of bad stuff. So, Hule has been a lifesaver of mine for 3 years. And as I've said before, it's such a joy to have a sponsor that you genuinely believe can help people change their lives if they would only start using the product. So, let's get back to the podcast. Anxiety is a really interesting topic. I've been involved in this mental health company for some time now. A Thai and I've just got really fascinated about the concept of anxiety. Oh, it's [ __ ] horrible. Just I and I've experienced it as well. I've I've Oh, yeah. Been there. Tell me about your experience with anxiety. Um, and when And was it later in your life that you first? Uh, I think the first time I'd had anxiety was after my mom died in the in the immediate. I didn't know what was going on. I just remember being in the room and saying to my mates, "My chest is getting really tight. I'm I feel like I'm struggling to breathe." And I was like, "Uh, and then, you know, the doctors hired us some volume and [ __ ] I think I had that with some alcohol at the same time." And that that was when the forcing myself to sleep sort of was was started. But um as I got older um I realized uh through the YouTube thing just like being known is is a really weird thing particularly obviously around that time with the the fall of True Jordy as I called it on the video. Uh lots of anxiety and depression. Um and it is just such a horrible feeling to go through. cuz it feels very serious at the time. Yeah. But it it is in your head, isn't it? Really? You've been very open about your and I don't want to continue on this topic cuz we got a lot of lot to talk about. You've been very open about your
depression and suicidal ideation. And one thing that I haven't quite managed to get over in your head is what you said earlier where you said one of the things that actually made you hang in there was that people didn't want you to hang in there. And that's the fire. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I I I like I sort of there there was a there was a tweet that was tweet tweeted at me. It's such a weird little confession. Uh where a guy went um I've heard about your financial issues or whatever he said in his tweet and it couldn't happen to a better guy and I've got like a dark sense. I sort of smirked at it and I thought in my head I thought I know I am not beaten. like I just know it and I and I know I'm going to be rich and I know shit's going to go come back around. So I just screenshotted the tweet and I remember thinking I'm going to use that as like an air freshener on a Ferrari or something. You know what I mean? Like I have this like I don't know. You know what I mean? Like I want to prove people wrong and and and I think that drive at the start was a lot of that was like when I started YouTube so many people like the [ __ ] is this idiot doing like shouting on his camera and all that. So then all of a sudden there was that that that negativity came in droves, [ __ ] thousands of tweets. Um, and yeah, it was sort of a weird like, oh, it's like starting the game again, but like on a different level. So I'm like, okay, now I'm [ __ ] but I've been [ __ ] worse before. So like it's kind of like a all right, let's let's use this a bit. So, but to sort of uh yeah, the depression, it's it's like it's awful and it's so negative and you think about like I was thinking about suicide on a daily basis at one point. I was, you know, I'm sorry if this is bringing people down when they listen to this, but um you know, I was really seriously contemplating it in in a way of like here's what I would do. And and and when the anxiety attacks were coming over me, it was just an awful way of living. And I honestly don't know how I got through what I got through. Like I looking back at it. Uh it was [ __ ]
mental. Um I've never been um to that point. So when I hear people talking about it, it just it's like incomprehendable to me that you could get to the point where you think the best route is to end your life. So yeah, I mean looking looking at it at the time, I thought I had what was like situational depression where I'm in this horrible situation and that's why I'm depressed, which was partly true obviously, but I was also chemically depressed as well. Like there was what I now realize is through that my mom dying other trauma in my life I definitely had chemical depression like I needed I needed medication you know um but um I sort of um didn't believe in it. Didn't want to do it. Didn't think it would work uh for me, you know. And also like when you're a guy who's um lives in his head and thinks, you know, I'm a smart guy, yada yada yada, you sort of you're worried it's going to change the way you think and make you a bit what if it makes me dumber, you know, some something silly like that or you hear about other people's bad experiences on it, like [ __ ] your libido, all of this sort of weird [ __ ] puts weight on you. There's just all sorts of little fears. So, um, it had to get so bad, uh, before I would try medication. But like one day it got bad enough where I was like I I realized I thought I'm definitely going to do it sooner otherwise. Um, I I'm going to have to I was like frightened almost like as a kind of like as a friend of me if that makes sense. Like I'm I was frightened for me cuz I was like you're really going to [ __ ] do this here soon. like uh the way I was thinking and the way my life was going and the way I was feeling about small things that really are like you know when people sort of push your buttons a little bit the way that was making me feel was awful like I was shouting at my friends and my crew and uh when someone was challenging me in any way the the fear and anxiety was bubbling underneath it was just overwhelming and I had like really bad nightmares and I'd wake up in the morning. And I remember just waking up one morning just being like, "Oh, I really don't want to live anymore." And
that was when I was like on the phone to the doctor and I was like, "Give us whatever the [ __ ] you've got cuz I'm willing to try anything now." And uh thank [ __ ] you know. Um so they uh they prescribed us some anti-depressants and I'm really [ __ ] glad I tried them, mate. Honestly, you called the doctor yourself. Mhm. One night, one morning. Uh it was in the morning. No, it was you woke up and thought I need to call Yeah. I just knew I thought I'm like I'm I'm I'm a liability to myself here. And it was like the fear of oh [ __ ] you're getting dangerously close. Like you like thoughts become things, right? So like we we know that because when we challenge our um channel our brains in an ambitious way, we can make magic happen. But also if I'm thinking negatively, I can go to the worst possible place. And I really knew I was like almost manifesting it because it I was spending so I there was so many times it would pass through my head if oh well I'll just kill myself. Oh well I'll just kill myself. Oh like if this doesn't happen if this doesn't happen if this doesn't happen. It was it was becoming an answer. It was becoming a solution to all of the problems that felt like they were mounting on my shoulders and stuff like that. Um, so yeah. Um, and when I took the medication, that was when it really dawned on me like, oh, that wasn't just cuz of what I've been through or it was a it was yeah, post-traumatic stress disorder and all sorts of other [ __ ] but it was also like a chemical imbalance probably in the brain where my serotonin levels were real low. Um, and you know, I was desperate, so I'm glad I took them. I never see you meditate, go on holiday, relax, chill out, go to the jungle. I was in the jungle and you you messaged me and said, "Oh, I need a little bit of that." Yeah. I mean, you look like you were having a a whale of a [ __ ] time. Um Yeah, but I am on like a treadmill, you know what I mean? like and I'm not quite at that point of um financial um what I want from life financially. I
haven't quite clinched that moment of Will you ever upset? Yeah, I will. I will. You think so? Yeah. Yeah. Cuz I don't think I have. Um you No, but doesn't it? Yeah. But we're at different points, you know what I mean? Sort of like um financially speaking. Um, I'm nearly there. I think I'm I'm getting there. I I've got a really good organized team now. Money is is sorting itself out. And it's like if I just carry on the way I'm going, we'll be okay. And then I can have those moments where I go now. I'm going to rest. I'm going to enjoy myself. But yeah, I don't I don't meditate. I don't uh you know, how do you relax? um glass of wine and um I say a glass of bottle of wine. Uh but you know um were you ever taught how to relax? No, not really. I I feel like I don't really re like the minute I put out something I'm really happy with. I get this feeling of like content. Like I'm like, "Oh, that's class. That that's a really good piece of work that I'm really happy with that." But then like 10 minutes will go by and that'll be when I'm like, "Okay, what what we doing next then?" You know what I mean? And I think like, you know, we have that in common for sure. And I no doubt that when when I hit that point where I'm financially secure, I'll still carry on being a bastard. But I will chill out more. I will I will chill out more. And I'm already chilling out more since I started the anti-depressants actually. like in terms of the way I behave like all of those I'm so much more in control of myself now my anger my ups and downs like you know there are everything's a lot more relaxed and and I communicate in a way that's not as um like you know there was times where people would piss me off and I would just not even look at them because I would be so frustrated that when I'd tell them I wouldn't I wouldn't even be able to look at them cuz I'd be like I want to punch you right now So, I'm not going to look, you know what I mean? Like, I I I just exude anger. Even when
I was trying to hold it back, it was there obvious and I don't want people who work with me to feel like they're working with a [ __ ] lunatic. You know what I mean? So, the the anti-depressants have been a godsend. And um that's really helped me communicate and now now if I have an issue, I just sit down and I'm just honest and calm and I just go, here's what's gone wrong. Here's what I think we should do better. if you want to hear tell me what I need to do better. I'm more ears and it's like I'm a different I'm a better person now. You know what I mean? Still not the finished article by any means. Got lots of work to do. But it just made me realize like my and it it goes back ironically to to the trolls, you know, even even the trolls who gave me all that [ __ ] It's like when you're really unhappy within yourself, it comes out everywhere. And and that was really what was happening to me. I was like, and part of it actually made my YouTube videos good cuz like the pain that like that fall of True Jordy video, uh, it it was just I just said, Lawrence, you need to [ __ ] sit down and I need to sit down cuz I've got so much [ __ ] I want to say right now. And if I don't get this out there, I'm going to [ __ ] explode, so we're doing this. It wasn't thought out or anything. Um, but it brings Sometimes it's like that struggling artist thing, isn't it? People like that a little bit, like to feel like they're battling something. So it makes the videos better. So it worked in my favor a little bit. I just I've just come to I mean from my own experiences and I'm sure you've heard this heard me say this before just when I when I was insecure, broke and striving to be rich and successful upon actually getting there I realized that that was totally unfulfilling because it just moves off into the future. And so when I what I think I've come to learn maybe is happiness is in fact finding peace today irrespective of uncompleted goals. That's definitely in my head as well. Peace. That word peace today. Yeah. Like in even in the last month actually I remember thinking I only want to be around people who are who make me feel
peaceful. If you bring drama, if you bring aggro stress, you can [ __ ] off because I'm trying to turn over a new leaf now and not deal like. And I think a lot of people just did not realize like while they were heaping stuff onto my plate because I'm the mountain of a man who can handle anything apparently that I was at [ __ ] breaking point and I just wasn't saying it, you know? Whereas now I'm saying it. I'm like, "No, I'm not doing that." like you know the other day one of the lads in the team said it was um oh um it was about research or something like you know for graphic design and stuff and and me mate went it was um oh it would help if you if you had a look and I said would Joe Rogan's team tell him to do that or do your own research Joe you know and and now I'm just very much like he has the standards this is what we do and you know and are you still do you think this is what really what I'm getting at here is do you think you're still attaching some happiness to the future attainment of some goal or or this is this is scary it's it's it's healthy in a way because it's like I'm not under the illusion that the minute I hit the big number that all of a sudden I'm going to um that will make me happy but the freedom that that number will then give me is what I'm looking for. Freedom from what? Freedom to freedom of choice. Freedom to do whatever I want with my life. Right now, I'm a slave to the game. The game for me right now is I've got the all these shows, all these brands that I'm trying to build. I'm doing the fighting. I've got the kickoff, the football brand. I've got the podcast and other things I'm working on as well, like my poker and and stuff and Twitch. I am on a treadmill where every single week I have to do I'm contracted to do this show, this show, this show. I'm the most consistent YouTuber in the UK. It's just nobody really realizes it because it's kind of always been that way. I've always been that the guy like even though I slowed the podcast down in terms of like the amount of videos I've been putting out, it's been insane from for years now. Um so I I have to do them because I'm not
at a point of financial freedom. And even when I am, I might still carry on. But it would be nice to have the option to go, "Yeah, I'm going to do this and and yeah, I'm going to interview that guy." Hey, if I want to interview a guy in America, I can stop the kickoff cuz I just don't want to do it this week or I'll let my other boys do it and I'm going to go to LA and interview Joe Rogan. You know, I'd love to have the ab I can't do that. I'm chained to my content and I love my content fortunately and I love the people I'm around. But if I if I if if I didn't, it would be really hard. Got you. I've I've been thinking a ton about this. It's actually again the last chapter in in um in the book I was writing and I I think my conclusion my my book's actually quite similar. Yours called Happy Sexy Jordy. Is it? Where'd you get the name from? No, it's just that last I was I thought so much about ambition and my conclusive point was when you realize that you are enough and you actually don't need more money or you don't need more external validation that foundation is such a contradiction right that when you realize that you're actually you've got everything you need then you then the result is true ambition not ambition to impress girls with a Lamborghini not ambition to prove everyone wrong but you go after the things that you actually genuinely give a [ __ ] about and when you get to the point where you are you know that you're enough, then you start to go for things just for the sake of like the intrinsic intelligence. That's what I'm talking about, bro. That that's where I am. It's like I know I want to get there, but I'm not there yet. And and when when I get that big [ __ ] off deal, that's insane. Then I can be like, I mean, unfortunately, that'll mean more work, but um there you go. Right. But but I'll have the money to then have that in um bring the plane into land eventually and go, "Okay, now what do I want to do?" M um ultimately the funny thing is I'm doing what I want to do now. I'm just doing a lot more of it than probably physically I should be. You know what I mean? It would be nice to have a bit
more bigger a bigger team is really what I'd like to do is put put invest more into the team and have like more people to help me cuz me and the boys we do a lot. It's funny because it feels like the snowball then gets bigger as it's rolling down the hill. possibly add five more people then that means more brand obligations to pay for them. Do you know what it is though? It would make me so [ __ ] happy to be um I I know this is like I I get why this is [ __ ] but it's also like it's enough for me. Even people from Newcastle have like underestimated me. Even people who should be championing me and supporting me are telling me I ain't [ __ ] So just to like go beyond what anyone could even imagine, it would be such a [ __ ] ride. And ultimately, that's all I want to do at the end is look back and go, "Fuck me. I showed those [ __ ] didn't I?" Like, and and have a good laugh and spend time with my friends, make great videos. That's what I want to do. What What What are your ambitions now then? I don't think you've you know, you've signed this deal with um obviously Gym Shark, which is great, and you've you've done a deal with Beats, which is great. You're over on Twitch now. Poker stars as well. Shout out poker stars. Got to love poker stars. What is the big when you talk about that big, you know, vision that you have in your mind of where you will be in 5 10 years from now. What is that? Um I feel like I've I'm in a bit of a unique situation in that I want to kind of be the king of multiple different things. And uh it's going to be interesting to see how that that goes. Uh, I think I'm the best podcaster currently um about uh aside from Joe Rogan. No offense to your good f I think you're very good. Um, and uh, you know, I want to kill the podcast game, but that's been something that I've had to uh in the in in the past when that [ __ ] happened, I I kind of had to put that back and go, where where's the money going to come from? and sports is a lot easier to make money out of. So I I I went full steam ahead with the kickoff. I think I've got something really
special with the kickoff. That to me is the the future of football in terms of how people will consume it in the UK. That that show the the brand, the kickoff, the the the personalities I've got there. I'm working on rebranding it right now. You know, Gillette Soccer Saturday is dying a death. I seen it coming in my off soccer is so [ __ ] like they've all piled like there's what they're happening in that space right now. There's so many YouTube channels they're faking their views. They you I know them all. They they've got all the big brands Budweiser, you're getting robbed. I'm just saying that right now. You want to check the [ __ ] Why have Why have certain YouTube channels switched the likes off, switch the views, switch the comments off? Cuz they're [ __ ] buying views and stuff like that. what we've got is so authentic and real. My studio, I've spent hundreds of thousands of pounds on the equipment in there. We've we we've got something special there. So, it's just about watering it and and letting it grow. And if I build the team right, I think we could like No one can [ __ ] with us. Like, everyone's copying us. Everyone's copying the kickoff. No one can copy the kickoff. They're all wasting their time. All they do is make us look better. their [ __ ] attempts at the kickoff make us look 10 times stronger. So with that one, I think we've got something really special there. And I'm surprised a huge brand has not seen that yet, like an Amazon or or a Google or whoever the [ __ ] you know, cuz all right, we swear on there, but we are killing it, you know, and and credit to Twitch. They did see it and you know, I'm proud of that. But the potential for that brand, I just think is enormous. I just like I say, I've been through so many financial struggles while keeping that going. I haven't really been in a had a chance to put it in third gear yet, but I'm we're getting there. Um, and then there's the fighting. I feel like thanks to Logan Paul and KSI, they've put me in a really particular position where I really know fighting, but I also know the entertainment side of fighting. And as as boxing moves towards that direction and and MMA as well and my history of loving boxing in UFC, I can really nail down a special place in that where you
know live streamwise where we're number one on fighting and football. How weird is it that there's one guy in the world who does a live stream on football and he's got the number one audience and fighting? You know, that alone puts me in a really unique position without having to talk about the podcast where it's Ricky Jace one week, it could be Camaro Usman, UFC champion the next, Tyson Fury, Logan Paul. Do you think you've got the credit you deserve? I I definitely don't. No. Why? Um I don't know. I don't know. Um, I think, you know, I just did an interview, for example, with Kamar Usman and the older I get and the wiser I get and the better at questioning I get and the and and the better I get as an interviewer and leading the the guest and and taking them on that journey. My emotional compassionate side is really another gear that I have that other interviewers. I just, you know, I've always aspired to be like Joe Rogan, but Joe Rogan has things I don't and I have things he doesn't. He knows everything about everything. This guy can talk to anyone. I I just don't have that. But my emotional compassionate side, my empathy, I think, gives me something else. And on that on that interview, I got so many comments because it was one of the first interviews I've done, which was the same guest Joe Rogan had. I saw the comments and loads people going, "You did, you [ __ ] outdid Joe Rogan with that one." And I knew I did. And I don't mean that as a disrespect cuz he's like a god to me. But on that one, it really showed because I just did a totally different interview. And um and I I'm Joe is always going to be the goat to me, but sometimes even the goat can be got and I can get him every every now and then. And I and I'm he he's aspire to to to be on every podcast, you know? So maybe I don't know. I don't know what the [ __ ] it's going to take. Um I don't know if it's cuz I'm I feel like it's cuz I'm working class and I don't necessarily like some people just get credit thrown
at them. Like Mr. Beast, wow, you spent loads of money on a video. Uh, what's the other [ __ ] who's always surprised and his friends with cars? I don't give a [ __ ] Like, with all due respect, you don't impress me. None of like, you know, your creativity is bang average, you know? Like, I could turn up with [ __ ] money and buy a car for a friend. You know what I mean? So, I'm trying to tell stories like with the fall of True Jordy, with the rebuild, with the podcasts, th that content is like I poured my heart and soul into it. I edited it with my editor, Gio. Shout out to him. Amazing editor. We sat together and did frame by frame. I do the grade. I [ __ ] everything. Like every minute detail I care about. Why does my podcast look different everyone else? Cuz I care. And I will literally go and go, "Right, we're going to do the grade. We're going to do the sound. That doesn't sound right." And I I every [ __ ] detail I care about. So, it frustrates me that I'm not where I think I should be because the numbers are there, the deals are there, but the critical acclaim for whatever reason isn't there. And I guess it's cuz I swear and I'm not like mainstream worthy. Like, I'm never I'm never going to be the kid who Jonathan Ross invites on or, you know, I'm not and I don't want to I don't give a [ __ ] about being wellknown on telly. I don't want to go on it particularly. Um, and it's not because there's anything wrong with it. It's just I'm happy where I am, you know. But, um, I don't know what it's going to take, bro. Feel like I've got to move a [ __ ] mountain. No, I know. I I I was thinking about it then cuz I agree with everything you said in terms of the influence you have. And I and you I also agree that you are the best podcast in this country. And really, you were the one of the real pioneers of a certain style of podcasting, but also on the kickoff, right? You're a real pioneer there. But from what I've learned about company valuations and even how brands do deals, it's the way that it is packaged. Yeah. And look, I'm not greasing the wheels of these companies. And that's definitely a thing I need to do better because you talk about certain YouTube channels. Yeah. Certain YouTube channels will take people out for dinner. They'll
smoo. They'll do all of that [ __ ] And I'm clearly not doing that. But like credit to the companies who have invested in me cuz I've just went, "Look, I'm the best." and and and and you know, I learned how to do decks myself. I was I've done decks. I do all my own decks. You shouldn't be. I I sell I Well, I've just hired a guy, so he's going to do them from now on. But the point is is like I got I've done all right, you know. Yeah, you've done really well. I've done well. I don't I'm going to say it. You're not getting the credit you deserve. Yeah. And and it's, you know, and you're not getting the money you deserve either. I It's [ __ ] frustrating, bro. like, you know, I don't know what money you're getting, but I know it's not what you deserve. No. Yeah. Trust me, bro. It ain't what I No, I'm credit to the partners we've got cuz they've looked after us. Um particularly um Gym Shark and Poker Stars and Twitch. Um I'm grateful for for those people to be uh partnered with us. But yeah, I I I definitely feel like where where I am is not reflected. Um but yeah, I need to do the the the sch smoozing [ __ ] a lot better. and and the deck side of things. We've built that out and we're packaging up and branding wise I need to be a bit more there's a lot of rich old white dudes who sign the [ __ ] checks who I need to be more friendly towards. I and I get that. I don't even think you do. I think you need a bunch of rich old white dudes to be friendly with rich old white dudes. And I think you should probably call your company like true true entertainment. You put it all under there. If they value it as a YouTube channel, you're getting paid X. If they value you as a media company, a Buzzfeed or a Vice which I am. Yeah, you are. Which I am, but you're not present. You're not packaged like that. You're packaged as a YouTube channel. Vice is worth five like I don't know. No, it's it was 1.5 billion. Yeah.
Like if you think about the influence and reach, you're probably up there with Vice, but you you're branded differently. You're branded as a YouTube channel. So, and and I've done all this on a shoestring as well, bro. This I've been in like I've been in debt with the tax man. I got that rug pulled out from under me with the deal. I've had to scramble to get other deals. I had to pay off the production company, all the money I owed them. You know, you know that one who kept us going after the deal. I had to pay them off and then I went solo and got my own production company set up. So, we are beginning which is the obviously the concept where the promotion with the distribution. We are a [ __ ] media company. It's just [ __ ] frustrating because I don't know whose dick I've got to suck to get [ __ ] respect around here. Um, but I I should be a multi [ __ ] millionaire right now. Balling out of control. Not balling out of control. We are I should be going back down to the [ __ ] Audi garage now. Yeah, I'm pissed off. And and I think that chip on my shoulder is a healthy thing in a way because it'll just keep driving me to get that respect I deserve and ultimately to get the money to look after the people I care about. And that's that's the goal. It ain't about like ultimately yes I've got an ego. Yes, I want to be respected. Yes. But I could quit all that as long as I get the money to secure everyone who all my team all of that. You know what I mean? And you 100% own your your formats. Absolutely. Yeah. I pulled up on Heineken because they used the kickoff trademark and said, "I want my [ __ ] money." Really? Yeah. Shout out to Hinekin. They paid me off. Oh, they Yeah, they they used the kickoff and um I was like the kickoff, the European Champions League night uh on with Heineken and I'm like, "What the fuck?" Uh tweeted them and uh and yeah, I had everyone [ __ ] oh, can we make this go away? And uh but to be fair, the gaffer at Hayikin was cool as [ __ ] Well, he better have been because Yeah, you should sponsor the [ __ ] kickoff.
Quick one. As a serial entrepreneur that's currently building multiple projects across multiple industries, everything from the marketing industry to blockchain to consumer goods, everything. One of the things that has been a lifesaver for me, and again, a company that I reached out to to evangelize about on this podcast because I'm a loyal customer, and they ultimately ended up sponsoring this podcast, is fiverr.com. f i v err. What that site allows me to do is extend my capacity across all of my projects. If I'm looking for a graphic designer, someone to edit a video, someone to do a website for me, it allows me to extend my capacity without hiring people. And the quality of freelancers on Fiverr has been amazing. And when the the trust and the service you get is that phenomenal and the services offer offered are that diverse, it's a no-brainer. Whether you have one member of staff, you're a freelancer yourself, or a thousand members of staff, Fiverr can be a gamecher for you. And I'd love you guys to check it out. Use the link below. Go to fiverr.com/ceo and send me a screenshot. If you end up using the service, one of you is going to win something very amazing. Do you think you're happy? Now, I want to I want to answer this honestly. I'm I'm really really going there. Um, no, I wouldn't say happy is the right word, but I'm closer to in the middle than I have been in a long time. You know what I mean? Like that neutral point of like I'm not really happy, but I'm also not low. I'm I'm heading up to like okay, you know what I and I have more okay days than I have had in a long time since I started taking my anti-depressants and stuff. That's really helped me sort of level out a bit. So, yeah, I'm definitely a bit better, but I wouldn't say happy would be the right word. And also, I don't I'm not striving to be happy either. I think I'm striving for peace and content and um just uh yeah, you have your happy days, you're also going to have your bad days. But it's like I want to get to a place where I ride the storm and enjoy the good bits and appreciate them and know that there will be hard times again, but that I'm mentally equipped to deal with them and
that if I do have a uh a bad moment that I don't want to kill myself or anything. That's sort of my what I'm looking for. Do you know what it's going to the work what work it takes to get there? Do you have any idea what it's going to take to get to that day? Yeah, I I I think so. But also I'm I'm kind of think I'm one of those people that I'm I'm not anticipating an easy ride in life. I'd be a fool after everything I've been through to think, but now it's going to go great, you know? So, it's like um that's kind of why I search for money because I think money does solve a lot of problems and it can make life a lot easier and it's it's not like money isn't the answer, but that can help a lot. You know, freedom it gives you. Yeah. I'm still super scared/ conscious about my relationship with money because I know that there's nothing you can do to take that kid out of me. Oh, yeah. It will never leave me. Yeah. There's still bits of me, man. Like I say a fast car and I'm like, "Oh, [ __ ] me. I can really go for one of them right now." Bitcoin was taking off. I'm like, "Oh, should I should I get on the train?" Do you know what I mean? Once every 3 months, I'll send my friends, one of them's over there, and my manager and my my PA, a picture of a Rolls-Royce. And I'll just be like, "Should I do it?" Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I'll do it five times a year. I'll never buy it. But it's that kid showing up again being like, "Get [ __ ] show them." Yeah. And this all I've tried to do in my life is just be way more conscious of that kidding me. But but this is the thing is like at this point for you, everyone thinks you're way more loaded than you probably are anyway. So it's gone to a point where it's like for you there's nothing left to prove. You've you've proven it. You know what I mean? Like you you're and I guess Yeah, bro. Credit to you, by the way. You've done a [ __ ] good job. Oh, thank you. You're right. I'm proud of you. Yeah. Thank you, bro. I appreciate that. I hope you're proud of yourself as well.
Um, I am and you're right. I don't feel like I've got um a ton left to prove to people. And that's what I that's what I was kind of referring to. And that for me has been a really good place to actually realize what I care about in life because before it was all trying to get laid, trying to get girls, trying to get respect, trying to get followers, trying to get whatever. And when I was doing that, I was re I was getting I was making myself unhappy, but I was self-destructing. When you finally get to the point where you realize that you are actually never going to be internally worth more, you're never actually going to be more valuable as a human being. No matter how much money I have, my value doesn't change. But insecurity is is is is it's a it's a gift and a curse, isn't it? It's like rocket fuel. It's like before when I was talking about my podcast and how I'm underrated. You see the way I talk like the passion. Whereas Joe Rogan ain't [ __ ] talking like that. He's content. He is the king. Like he has nothing to And also I kind of envy it because he's never been that way. He's never been he's never come across as I need validation. Um and I I know that's in me. You know what I mean? And it's not a healthy thing. And I Do you think it's a good thing? I it it's certainly [ __ ] driven us. So I can't I can't hate it all. But it's like controlling it. It's like the the beast inside you and it it's like um mastering it, you know, and knowing when to let it go. And like it's that same thing that will make me obsess over the quality of the content or, you know, the detail or the research or and it's the same thing that when people let me down in a work situation, I get [ __ ] frustrated cuz I'm like, why the [ __ ] don't you want this as bad as I do? You know what I mean? But if they did, they'd be me. You know what I mean? I'm I'm I'm I'm me, they're them. But it's it just drives us [ __ ] insane sometimes, you know? I think it's about balancing that thing. And as you say, trying to master it cuz you're you're definitely right. It was like the [ __ ] rocket ship that took you here. But at some point, I think probably to fly, you've got to let go. M
and I genuinely think I've thought this from just watching from afar and seeing the similarities in me and you. I've thought to myself the day that Brian reaches his full potential will be the day that he no longer gives a [ __ ] about proving himself to people because I think then I think then how you operate becomes a lot more healthy and more more productive and more effective. You're not being driven by these external forces who clearly, you know, that don't want your best interest. you can be in control cuz you're not in control if if there's that driving you, right? You're not actually. And I'm the same. As I said, I'm on the treadmill, bro. And I'm and and the the day I don't need money anymore, that's going to be a scary day for the rest of the internet cuz the content's going going to [ __ ] change. Like, I don't know what the [ __ ] I'll do, but it'll probably one I don't know. I don't I don't want to let the fans down and and I don't want to stop doing what they they love me for. But I I am a person who evolves constantly and I'm always thinking and re-evaluating and you know what is this? What am I doing? Why am I here? All of that. And uh it'll be interesting to see what happens then. I'm I I'm excited to see if that get if that happens. You know what I mean? Like what I would say, what I will do. You're relentless like um Eddie Hearn. Yeah. Yeah. He's one of the most relentless characters I've ever met. And he told me, you know, he's just working for that day to sell his to sell Matroom. And I asked him why he wants to sell Matt if it's making him happy. And he goes, "Well, we were never supposed to be here." And it sounds a lot like what you say to me. And then he goes, "What I'm going to do is I'm going to sell Matt 5 billion. Then I'm going to go to the beach and smoke my cigar." And I said, "Eddie, you're not." No, but yeah, you're going to I'm not trying to do that. I I get that I love what I do. And but like take take Matchroom for example, right? This is me going on a rant again. I look at Done. I look at what Matroom are doing. I'm like, "You guys are [ __ ] geniuses. This is great. Why are you not
coming for me? Why what what you waiting for?" UFC had Joe Rogan. I've got a [ __ ] huge podcast audience. Every video I do about fighting gets loads of views. My production quality, my shows, um, you know, they've tried to copy my shows. No offense, but I know they I mean I can see the way they try to get a round table going. They got Joella in there and stuff like that. I see what they're doing. Good. Good on them. Like, you know, it looked all right. But we just come for the real McCoy pays the money and I'll I'll [ __ ] I'll make you guys I I'll help you out. You know what I mean? There might be an issue of being dependent then on you, right, for brands. Because if you're the main event, one day if you decide to cut the brand, but look at what Joe Rogan did with the UFC. It it was a perfect marriage. His podcast had the fighters on. He told the stories for the fighters. He helped promote them. They then go back into the UFC. They're now more relevant. They get more pay-per-view buys. And it's this it's a symbiotic relationship there where you give me the fight. You give me Anthony Joshua, the new Anthony Joshua. You need to build them up. And I tell the story better than he could himself. I help make a documentary on him better than he could himself. I'm king of content and I help you out on that. Like I don't know. I just feel like I've got all these [ __ ] skills and I'm sitting here making my own stuff, but like with a budget. Imagine what I made the rebuild. Me and two other guys made the rebuild. Like it was good, but imagine if I actually had a [ __ ] Netflix budget. You know what I mean? Like why don't you take investment then? Uh I I would consider it, but it would have to be from the right person who understood what the goal was and actually backed me. Unfortunately, cuz I've had those previous issues where companies have tried to um get me to sign over my IP for [ __ ] peanuts, um putting a gun to my head and [ __ ] like that. And I've had multiple people try and do that. It's made me very wary. You know, it would have to be a big amount of money and a good a good per long-term partner. So, you fancy it? No, I I genuinely I've always looked at
what you do and you know this anyway and I've always thought that you you had been undervalued and I tend to believe that and because you do you've been the king of what you do for a long time. Not blowing smoke up your ass. You know this anyway. No, but you know it's true. And um other people who aren't as good because they they're packaged as these like big media companies. They're getting the big seven eight figure destroys us, man. destroys when I hear I'm just going to [ __ ] take it when I hear [ __ ] got a massive [ __ ] deal with Budweiser or anyone. Well, bleep that bleep cuz they'll [ __ ] take me to court. Um, it destroys us cuz I'm just like, you guys are putting out [ __ ] content. You don't get any views. You randomly your your video, one video's got 10,000 views, the next video's got 5 million. No one asks anything. No one at Budweiser double checking that like that ain't that. And and I and I'm sure there's some back scratching going on behind closed doors where someone went to Eaton with his other [ __ ] mate and I'm not in invited to these business dinners, but if you actually want to sell some [ __ ] and you actually want to make a [ __ ] buzz and you want to kick ass on the next World Cup or whatever, we we do the content. We are pisses off. I can tell you you've had It's cuz cuz we me and my team work so hard. It's not just me either, you know what I mean? We're we're all like grafting constantly. My editor, for example, this kid works till like 4 in the morning [ __ ] regularly, you know, to to give everything. And um and that's someone's got to pay for that one day. Like I got to get my end result from that, you know? We we do cuz it won't I'm very loyal to them and I and we all deserve that. Do you know what I mean? that moment of look at what we've built. You know, when I see Spotify signing um they've just signed the girl in the uh in America. Yeah. Uh call her daddy. Yeah. Right. They give her a [ __ ] huge contract. I'm like, look at her views. Look, what the [ __ ] am I doing over here? Like I don't know
what it is, man. I don't know what it is. But um do you think I'm right when I say it's because you've not packaged yourself as a media company that you Well, I think call her daddy had a lot of help from bar stool and obviously bar stool being a huge company in America. They packaged her well and and put her on the map and stuff and we've had to do every like you when you met me I was in a [ __ ] bomb shelter, bro. I I paid a toothless Russian man £50 a day for a sweaty bomb shelter cuz that's all I could afford when when I met you in 2017 cuz a company had sacked me. A company had let me go because they quote unquote I'm not brandable and they couldn't make money out of me cuz they couldn't sell me properly because of the way I was. And I was on 50 quid a day paying rent for the studio and that studio was [ __ ] horrible. But now Poker Stars, Beats by Dre, Gym Shark, and Twitch apparently think I'm marketable. So I proved that [ __ ] wrong, didn't I? Sometimes it does feel good to prove people wrong, Steve. Do you know what I mean? But that's not the goal. The goal The goal is the bank balance. Proving him wrong when he said I wasn't sellable. Uh, I've competed with a company before when I was in the bomb shelter for a for a sponsorship which was a six-f figure sponsorship deal and they were a 20 million pound company and I beat them. You know what I mean? So to say I've come up from nothing is the understatement of the [ __ ] century and I just um I need to get to that point where I'm content like yourself. I just hope and pray and I think this is what I I keep you can hear me keep coming back back to it is I just hope that you don't believe too much in you getting there and finally being completely happy and content. I don't I'm I'm aware what you're saying and I've had plenty of money before and I've I've had the the adrenaline dump of bloody driving a fast car and all that. You you you can live anywhere in the world. You can drive any car in the world. If the people around you aren't who you want to be around, if you yourself aren't content, it doesn't matter because I wanted to kill myself
in in in a in a in a situation where many people would have felt like it was the best thing and all of that. And I I'm aware of what you're saying. I just want it all. I want the content, peaceful, happiness, nice people around me, and I want the money. And it's a it's life's a good ride in it, so I might as well go for it. [Music] I think it's possible. Do you do you know you want to know something that's funny? Do you know what during that um that week of hell I had? I remember um I was just sat there. I was like I think I was having no whiskey at the time. And uh this is what like a dark sense of humor I've got. I remember thinking this is so [ __ ] isn't it? But what a ride. Like there was just a bit of me that was like this is a [ __ ] story isn't it? Jesus sometime like you know what I mean of yourself. Yeah. You just got to laugh and go hey my life is not [ __ ] boring if anything like it was like you know got to laugh at it sometimes. I'm your fitness stuff at the moment. I've been getting very into health and fitness. Yeah I've seen that. Yeah. You're looking shredded. Thank you bro. Yeah. I'm on I'm on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on his friends on his close friends. Yeah. I say that I say the stories other people don't say. It's like getting cut as well. How how's that how's that um impacted your life just having you know you've started boxing and you've started working out a lot and you're looking good. Thank you. Yeah. How's that had an impact on your mental health? It's be honest with me. It's It's great in terms of like making you feel better and and you have a great workout and you get the endorphins and stuff, but also weirdly there's the um if I have a bad week, I feel worse about it. Like if I have like
a week where I haven't trained or I've put weight on and stuff like that, it makes me go, "Oh, [ __ ] I'm letting myself down here." You know what I mean? I need to [ __ ] sort myself out. Supposed to be a Gym Shark athlete. You know what I mean? Like, so now there's more pressure on it if anything, but um are you going to fight? Uh you've got to fight. I don't know who cuz you're massive, but I think I might do something like a charity boxing match at some point. Something that isn't like what the YouTubers do. I'd rather I I'm I'm sparring quite a lot now and I'm getting some like heavyweight sparring in with like I'm going to get some pros to spar with me and stuff like that and really push myself. I feel like what a lot of these YouTube boys do is they call someone out and then learn how to fight. Whereas I'm actually just learning how to fight because I enjoy it and and also because I'm dedicated to what I do. Like if you look at my analysis on fighting 3 4 years ago when I did Logan Paul KSI one or Joe KSI and then look at what I can do now when I break a fight down, it is [ __ ] so much better now. And I think a lot of the, to be fair, a lot of the boxing and MMA fans, although they they always disagree with you, I think a lot of them are recognizing like this guy's getting punched in the head just to learn fighting so he can do better videos. And that's real dedication. So that's my actual goal to be better on camera. But I do love fighting for whatever reason. And it just brings out this all the things about me that I've probably showed in this podcast are um that they come out in the in the ring when you're being challenged and wanting to quit but keeping going anyway. Like I think every entrepreneur has that in them really. They're all fighters. They're just doing it in a different way. But when you're in a boxing ring, it really brings that out of you. And um it gives you some sort of self-worth and self-esteem cuz I I got that when I was at my lowest point really my depression. Um like all of a sudden it was like yeah I am tough. I'm not just a big lad. I'm hard as [ __ ] nails me you know and it give me a lot of give me a good thing in the in a time I really
needed it. So, if I was to do a fight, it would probably I'd rather do it like a social club where everyone's getting piss drinking pints and I'd live stream on my own channel or something and and donate everything to charity rather than making it like a spectacle. Yeah. And I'd rather fight a real amateur fighter who I respect, he respects, no trash talk, shake hands, we'll have a pint together afterwards and you know, just something like that really. you when you were going through that depress depressive period and you started boxing, I noticed that you stopped podcasting as much and you talked about how that was to do with money, but I I Yeah, it was also mental health. Yeah, I it's hard to do a 2-hour podcast even now. I'm I'm I'm in a much better place now, but it's still it comes out. It we I talk about it cuz this was my state of mind and obviously this is a podcast about my life. But um when you're really rock bottom, I could get on and we do these uh comedy videos for those who haven't seen them called True News where we basically look at the the news and we just rip the piss out of it. And um you know, people like Pier Morgan and the like, they get they get a lot of stick off us and um I can do that because we can edit it down. It's it's me and Lawrence. we're laughing and joking and then afterwards, you know, you you you switch off and you go back to being normal. When you're podcasting, there's really nowhere to hide. And that's what I love about podcasts is like you really do get a good idea of who someone is if they podcast regularly. It's hard to hide. It's hard to pretend, you know, and that's why I didn't do it cuz I knew I couldn't lie to the I didn't want to lie to the audience. So, I didn't want to I'd rather come out and do like a month later and when I'm feeling up to it and tell them what I've been going through. So, for example, when like I say like when my mom died, I never mentioned it or when when my dad went through um his um suicide attempt, I only did a podcast on it once I knew he was all right and once that moment had been and gone. Um, it's difficult when you're a podcaster and you're living a life to to to pretend like this isn't happening to
you. You also turned off all the comments on your social media channels. Why? I just I was just thinking then I was like I realized I can't respond to your tweets anymore or I can't reply to Instagram. You know what? Uh, that's an interesting one, isn't it? Because it's something no YouTuber ever does cuz it's bad for engagement. And I did that on a couple of YouTube videos as well. And they still trended in the top 10 in the world. And I realized, well, that's bollocks then. Oh, you need comments for engagement. No, you don't actually. Um, and you know, when you're watching something on Netflix, you're not like, I need to comment on this. So, why why is the comment such a big deal? But mainly, uh, I got to a point where mentally I realized this wasn't helping me. And for all I get lovely comments and and shout out to the fans, you know, they they make us who we are. The negative ones were so um nasty at times. It made me just think, I don't need any of these. And there's that old [ __ ] poem um is it Roard Kipman? Treat these two imposters just the same. You know, treat treat people who who who praise you and people who criticize you. I I just thought you can all keep your comments because I'm going to do what I'm going to do regardless to be honest with you. You the numbers you're watching it cool. But for my own mental health, I don't want to hear it, right? Watch it. Enjoy it. Don't watch it. Don't enjoy it. Vote with your feet. I don't need to read this stuff right now because it ain't helping me. So, uh, you know, a lot of people, even people in my team were like, "Oh, you know, you shouldn't do this, shouldn't do that." And I was like, "Bro, if you're going to sit and troll through these troll through these comments and delete them all hours of the night, cool. But if you're not, I'm turning them off." And it's it's really helped me that it's cuz cuz it's like I put a tweet out, I put an Instagram post out, I put and and and and I'm not going, "What are the comments saying? What are they good? Are they bad?" I just go, "Fuck it." Do you know what I mean? Like the video is the video. And that's who I really am because I truly I
don't want to sound like it's it's a weird thing to say. I don't give a [ __ ] but like I do give a [ __ ] in a way if that makes sense. Like I want you to enjoy it, but if you don't enjoy it, cool. But if you're then going to try and insult me for it or say anything bad about me, I'm not interested. You know what I mean? Cuz I know I'm a good person. I know I look after the people around me. I know I've got a lot of good qualities and I don't need you guys tearing me down right now. So, that's sort of the way I look at it. Just it's so it's so one would say it was it's not surprising to me cuz I think I've I've spent a long time talking to people on this topic, but it would be surprising to someone viewing in thinking, you know, true Jordi big man, you know, says he doesn't give a [ __ ] swears down the camera all the time. And then for him to be affected by the comments on Instagram, it feels like a it feels it's not, but it feels like a contradiction, doesn't it? To to to the outside person who's viewing in. But then, okay, so to be absolutely brutally honest, then to really narrow it down for someone who might think that that is a contradiction, it's like um I don't mind whether you like me or hate me. I'm actually fine with that. But if you insult me, that will hurt my feelings. So, I'm choosing not to listen to either side because I truly don't care if you like me or hate me. You know what I mean? I don't care. I just don't want to hear it because then I will care and I don't want to have to do that. And that's the truth. You know what I mean? And I'm comfortable with that reality of some people will like me, some people won't like me. And I think to be as honest I have from day one and just be like, "Fuck it." Put out there like that. I'm not I'm not trying to make people dislike me. If anything, I want to make people enjoy life, forget about their problems, have a laugh, and it's probably as passionate as I've come across here sometimes, I'm really like a light-hearted person. And and surprisingly, I think one of the main things people say about me when they get to know me is I'm actually really chilled out off camera, but when the camera comes on, I know it's time to
[ __ ] do what I do. And it's like the volume goes up and the opinions become more powerful, more passionate, more inum definitive, you know what I mean? And I don't know, that's just what I've learned to do. Mhm. Yeah. It's what I've come to learn about you as well. I think the first time I met you, I remember thinking, "God, this is such a such a soft um nice, kind gentleman." I am I am soft as [ __ ] actually. But then there's this there's this exterior which is can be quite can be quite like aggressive at times and that it's that and it comes back to what we started the podcast on really is it's that two sides to me like and I kind of called it my mom and my dad but yeah very much so like there's my mom side of me which makes me the car and compassionate interviewer who can pull things out of people I think other people can't and make people feel like it's okay to share that. And then there's the arrogant showoff who has a huge ego sometimes. And uh that is my dad's qualities, you know, coming out in me. And um I'm I am lucky to have both of those, you know, cuz it is such a weird combo. Um but yeah, I guess uh is that it? Yeah, that's it. Yeah. No, I I genuinely I've been fascinated by you by you for so long and the more you shared and the more vulnerable you've been online, the more it's it's all started to make sense to some degree. And and I'm I'm I'm looking forward to see where we go with it, you know, cuz I want to dig deeper. I want to I want to I want to be even more vulnerable. I want to I want to go further in the future. But I got to grow. I like to grow as a person and then let it come out like in stages cuz you know like you know how people like us we sort of we're mulling things over on a daily basis like who am I? What am I becoming? Is this the direction I want to go in? All these [ __ ] questions. And when you do that every single day and you're laying a brick in the house that eventually becomes like the person you are in your life. 3 months to someone like that is a lot. They can do a lot. So yeah, I I feel like we can I'm I'm I'm looking forward
to finding out that direction and and hopefully making a shitload of money. As I said, that's the if anyone any I know a lot of investors listen to this podcast if you if you info@ true.com if you want to we'll end it there. But no, I genuinely do you know crazy thing crazy things have happened from people that have listened to this podcast. So I know that a certain big brand got a very big deal off the back of Yeah. Yeah. probably worth figing favor. It could work out for me. No, but you have you've really done me a favor cuz you know we just for anyone that's listening, we had a a guest um move till next week and Ben Franc. Honestly, if I wasn't his favorite employee, I better be now. I tell you, I text you I think yesterday or the day before and you've you know moved things around to be here. So, I appreciate that and I owe you a big big favor. But um and you didn't have to, you know what I mean? We're all very busy, so I do honestly appreciate that. No, I've always we've always got on. All right, mate. And um and I I've always um you I like obsessive people who are pushing themselves to the limit and uh I I I appreciate what you're doing and you've always been respectful of the the space that we're in because I feel like you're trying to bridge the gap a bit between mainstream, hence the TV show and all the other stuff, but also the space that I come from. And uh you don't talk down to people who are on this side. And I think there's a lot of people who are in the mainstream who sort of they just don't know what the [ __ ] we're doing over here. And by the time they do, it'll be too late and they'll be swallowed by this industry. So I'm coming for your job. I agree, man. And I, you know, I I look at you as a businessman and I genuinely and I'm sure a ton of people watching this will as well. I just see and I've always you probably know this. I've always seen a massive opportunity because I do think what you do represents the future and I also think the way you present your content and not having the filter also represents the future because the reason we have watershed and this and the BBC are so
scared of everything even though I'm now on the BBC is um uh is because they is because of the medium in which we deliver the content TV. Look at Sky. If you look at Sky social media, they're trying to copy us every step of the way now. They they're trying to do what we do. You know what I mean? And and that's a compliment. And they're pulling YouTubers in from Oh, all the time. But when Sky set up their own version of the kickoff, that was the ultimate compliment. And when it went down in flames within two years, it was an even bigger compliment. We're going to end the podcast here, but we'll talk we'll talk we'll talk offline about, you know, if there's any way now, I'm a free agent. Maybe there's some way that I can help you get the value that you've imagine you were the guy who finally sold True Jordy to the mainstream and made it all happen. If you can do that, then you'll really prove yourself. But we'll leave the we'll we'll we'll let Steve Bartlett go and do his Dragon's Den thing for now. Okay. But if you really want to see if he's good, can he sell true Jordy? Well, sounds like a jelly. I love how I'm playing with your ego to see. You know me as well. I'll be going upstairs. No. Well done on the dragon. Amazing, isn't it? [Music]